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Unacceptable Mercedes Rust?

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I'm not proud to have to post this but over the past few years I've noticed many MB cars here in the Northeast US with rust which I consider unacceptable.  The W202, 203, 210 and 220 seem to be particularly rust prone. 


 I really love Mercedes cars as I was practically born into them.  I've driven nothing else all my life except for a BMW during my college years.  I've put over 500,000 miles on Mercedes automobiles. I'm particularly proud of an 800,000 mile 220D which I successfully drove cross country and back with no breakdowns.  I'm also proud of a 450SEL which was driven to 330,000 miles with absolutely no engine work except for a timing chain replacement.  I still have a 1971 220 bought new by my parents.  This car is in pristine shape. 

I am still the proud owner of mostly older cars: 1958 300d, 1963 220SEb coupe, 1971 220, 1971 280SL, 1973 220D, 1982 240D and a 2005 G500.  I am however very hesitant to purchase anything new or newer from Mercedes based upon what I consider a pretty bad rust track record.  It's too early to tell what the W204, 212, 221 etc models will do and honestly I'm not sure I want to find out.  I would really like to continue to buy Mercedes cars but some reassurance would be necessary.  Where I would get the reassurance I don't know!!

Here are some pictures I've taken over the past few months to illustrate my point.  These are not what I would consider fluke occurrences as I've seen many, many more such cars which I did not photograph.  These cars have rust everywhere - not just one isolated panel which could be attributed to poorly done bodywork. All these photos were taken in Massachusetts.


 

W202
.

 

W210


 



 


W220




 

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Are there any cars, by any

Are there any cars, by any other manufacturer, that you would consider "rustproof" in those briney Northeast states?  Okay, not the bodies of Corvettes or Deloreans (both can rust, besides).

As I understant automotive design and metallurgy . . . virtually no car is rustproof, but one can minimize the adverse effects with careful maintenance. particularly in area that still use salt to de-ice roads.  I would love to hear the experiences of folks in OR or WA, states that do not use road salt.

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They don't all rust

Judging from the unevenness of the surfaces it looks like the panels shown have all had some sort of repair work done to them.  If the repair work was not done properly, resulting rust is not surprising. 

My W203 and W215, as well as the Sprinter, all from 2004, don't have a spec of visible rust anywhere, and you can believe that I'm constantly on the lookout for it. 

So what 's fair to say is that repaired panels rust easily. New ones don't.

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No car is rust proof but I

No car is rust proof but I have been checking out camrys and Lexus of the same vintage and I've found very little to no rust.  BTW, I despise Toyota products so again, I'm not proud to admit this.  My brother has a '96 Volvo 850 with 250K miles.  That car has lived in the Northeast all its life and has been poorly maintained.  It has virtually no rust. 

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I personally think it has

I personally think it has less to do with Mercedes and more with the owners.  Regular washing to remove the salty brine from the vehicle is a must, so is treating it BEFORE there's visable rust.  I treat the underbody of my cars yearly with a rust inhibiting coating.  It's not the prettiest underneath afterwards, but I know they won't rust.

My MB is the exception, as it's never been in the snow in it's life...no sense ruining it now.

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Alex wrote:Judging from the

Alex wrote:
Judging from the unevenness of the surfaces it looks like the panels shown have all had some sort of repair work done to them.  If the repair work was not done properly, resulting rust is not surprising. 

My W203 and W215, as well as the Sprinter, all from 2004, don't have a spec of visible rust anywhere, and you can believe that I'm constantly on the lookout for it. 

So what 's fair to say is that repaired panels rust easily. New ones don't.

 


I dismissed the bodywork excuse as these cars have rust literally EVERYWHERE. Not just one isolated panel or side.  How many miles on the 203 and 215.  Do you drive them in the winter/ salt?  I've noticed Sprinter vans to be particularly vulnerable as well.  I'm perfectly willing to take more photos to prove my point.
 

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jplinville wrote: I

jplinville wrote:

I personally think it has less to do with Mercedes and more with the owners.  Regular washing to remove the salty brine from the vehicle is a must, so is treating it BEFORE there's visable rust.  I treat the underbody of my cars yearly with a rust inhibiting coating.  It's not the prettiest underneath afterwards, but I know they won't rust.

My MB is the exception, as it's never been in the snow in it's life...no sense ruining it now.

True but your average Camry driver does not do as above.  It is rare to find a late nineties/ early to mid 2000s camry with that sort of rust. Why are our superior Mercedes automobiles rusting like this!
 

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There are so many variables,

There are so many variables, so no absolute answer is likely possible.

However, try doing a Google Image search for Camry Rust  or Camry Rust Recall, especially the 2007 model year.  Also in the Tundra.

Even a Volvo . . ..

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Yeah the vovo 240s are rust

Yeah the vovo 240s are rust prone as well but those are seriously old school cars!  We cannot include 70s cars here because they just did not have the technology to correctly rustproof them.  The w123s are for example great cars but also rust prone - nothing like a W210 though.  No car today especially a mercedes should start showing signs of serious rust after 5-6 years!  I'll look up the Camry as I'm curious now.

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I live in Oregon and I did

I live in Oregon and I did notice straight away after moving here that cars don't have rust generally speaking. I will say that I have seen several Mercedes with moss growing on them however, funny but seems pretty common for cars that aren't washed often in this region. I also believe it's a fault in the manufacturing of those cars, especially since you are comparing all models yet the older models seem to have less rust than the newer ones you specifically mentioned. Sure, owners who don't take proper care of their cars will suffer in the long run, but it's not like only W20 or W202 owners are not washing their cars. I wonder how much of this, if any, is due to the water based paint systems that were just being introduced around the time some of those models were being introduced to market, perhaps the small edge chips and scratches allow water and salt to more easily penetrate? It's maybe more than coincidence that the cars you notice are rusting quicker also happen to be the same models many people complain about how easily they acquire rock chips on the front bumper and hood. Something to consider.

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I have a w210 and have read a number of posts which have said that rust is a problem with these cars.  I was never much concerned, because my car has no rust that I can find.  However, last week I read a new thread that discussed the recent failure, due to rust, of the driver's side front spring perch in a 96 W210. The right front one had failed a year or two earlier on the same car, also due to rust.  At the time the right one was fixed, the mechanic examined the right one and said it was alright.  Then I googled "w210 spring perch" and found that this has been a problem on lots of W210's.  The problem is compounedd by the fact that rust that causes failure is at least sometimes not visible and cannot be detected by visual inspection.

Unlike rust on doors and other sheet metal, the problem of rust on the spring perches goes to the safety of the car.  A spring perch could fail on the highway and cause a horrid accident.  I'm concerned but not enough to switch cars.  I will have it inspected the next time that it is serviced and ask about any rust that can be found in the front end.

Ed Schwab
 

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I know in my area of western

I know in my area of western PA, they use a beet juice brine prior to using salt.  Ohio has been doing it for a while as well.  That brine has the ability to seep into every crevice of the metal, and is difficult to remove, even with washing. 

I think part of it is people not washing their cars regularly, part of it is the brine, and part of it is the lower grade steels that have been hitting the market for the last 15-20 years.  Russia and China have become rather large steel producers, and their steel isn't the same quality of American steel, which most of the formulations and quality came to us from Germany, through immigration. 

All auto manufacturers, even M-B, has been guilty of trying to get by with so-so quality lately, as they have to compete with cheaper autos made in Korea, Japan and other countries.  One of the first places to cut costs is the steel.

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I know that the W202, 203,

I know that the W202, 203, 210, 220 are doomed at least up here in the NE. I would likely never buy one of those models. I like the W204 very much and should I decide to buy one used in the future do I have to worry? What about the other current models? What, if anything, has Mercedes done to correct this problem? Have they learned what not to do from these models? Do they care?

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Under carriage inspection is

Under carriage inspection is considered part of the FSS service, and I would suspect that dealership service departments and knowledgeable independents in areas where corrosion is an issue check a little closer than other places. 

However, there are a fair number of owners (especially subsequent owners) that consider a trip to Jiffy/Quik/Turbo/Really Fast Lube all they need to do on their Mercedes; there are well meaning DIY owners that use an oil extractor to change fluids, filters and then reset the FSS indicator on their own, but never get the car up on a lift to do the under car inspections.

This is not to say that service people, whether at the dealer or independents, are guaranteed to find the start of corrosion 100% of the time, but there should be a regular inspection made with the car up on a rack.  That optimizes the opportunity to find it early.

Another matter . . . annually do an inspection of the water weeps in the trunk, the sunroof drains and the engine bay drains.  Dirt and debris can easily clog those rubber grommets and keep moisture trapped.

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KY snow?

Robert, Do you get much snow around Lancaster, KY?  Could snow and salt have caused your  problem?

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Ed Schwab wrote: Robert, Do

Ed Schwab wrote:

Robert, Do you get much snow around Lancaster, KY?  Could snow and salt have caused your  problem?

Ed Schwab
 

Yes Sir, plenty of snow and salt. I just figured that my clk 320 was protected enough from the elements.

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Rust free... ?

Here is a Gullwing that is just too rusty to try and fix.  Even the chassis tubing is thin and ready to break.  Car is totally destroyed.  Chassis number 5500192

brettel gullwing 006.jpg brettel gullwing 011.jpg brettel gullwing 012.jpg
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Give it to me. I'll fix it!

Give it to me. I'll fix it!

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stricht8 wrote:Give it to me.

stricht8 wrote:
Give it to me. I'll fix it!
I'll help my man, when do we get started?

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As soon as we get the car. Do

As soon as we get the car. Do you have a warm garage and cold beer?

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stricht8 wrote:As soon as we

stricht8 wrote:
As soon as we get the car. Do you have a warm garage and cold beer?
Warm garage but no beer, I stopped drinking beer about 6 months ago. I do have plenty of soda pop.

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I need beer and it needs to

I need beer and it needs to be cold! Maybe jp can supply us with some of his home brew? It'll be for the cause- preservation of a classic MB!

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Hale Merced wrote:Here is a

Hale Merced wrote:
Here is a Gullwing that is just too rusty to try and fix.  Even the chassis tubing is thin and ready to break.  Car is totally destroyed.  Chassis number 5500192

Funny, the ad said it ran when it was parked? Seriously tho, that is the most horrible thing I've seen in a while... when was that car ever not worth keeping at least covered??? Did you find that online or do you know that car?

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stricht8 wrote:I need beer

stricht8 wrote:
I need beer and it needs to be cold! Maybe jp can supply us with some of his home brew? It'll be for the cause- preservation of a classic MB!
Will Near Beer or O'Douls work?

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Sure. But it's got to be cold

Sure. But it's got to be cold - on the verge of freezing.

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stricht8 wrote:Sure. But it's

stricht8 wrote:
Sure. But it's got to be cold - on the verge of freezing.
I can do that. I have several vintage Coca Cola machines that will do the job.

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I know the car and the

I know the car and the owner.... He brought the car to me for restoration about 5 years ago... He totally misrepresented the condition of his car to me so I refused to work on it.  He left it outside in Stubenville Ohio for 30 years.. I guess when you only pay $6000 for a car in 1970's he didnt care.. But that was alot of money back then. Disgraceful...


 


Marrs wrote:
Hale Merced wrote:
Here is a Gullwing that is just too rusty to try and fix.  Even the chassis tubing is thin and ready to break.  Car is totally destroyed.  Chassis number 5500192

Funny, the ad said it ran when it was parked? Seriously tho, that is the most horrible thing I've seen in a while... when was that car ever not worth keeping at least covered??? Did you find that online or do you know that car?

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So what's happening to the

So what's happening to the car now?

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Is resurrection possible?

From the pictures it seems to me that this car is too far gone for restoration by a hobbyist.

On the other hand, maybe you can get an investor with deep pockets and make a TV documentary on robbing the grave or something along those lines.

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stricht8 wrote:So what's

stricht8 wrote:
So what's happening to the car now?
Yeah! what he said.

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Alex wrote:From the pictures

Alex wrote:
From the pictures it seems to me that this car is too far gone for restoration by a hobbyist.

On the other hand, maybe you can get an investor with deep pockets and make a TV documentary on robbing the grave or something along those lines.

I can fix it. Rust doesn't scare me!

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stricht8 wrote:Alex

stricht8 wrote:
Alex wrote:
From the pictures it seems to me that this car is too far gone for restoration by a hobbyist.

On the other hand, maybe you can get an investor with deep pockets and make a TV documentary on robbing the grave or something along those lines.

I can fix it. Rust doesn't scare me!
Me neither.

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The CLK Man wrote:stricht8

The CLK Man wrote:
stricht8 wrote:
Alex wrote:
From the pictures it seems to me that this car is too far gone for restoration by a hobbyist.

On the other hand, maybe you can get an investor with deep pockets and make a TV documentary on robbing the grave or something along those lines.

I can fix it. Rust doesn't scare me!
Me neither.

Robert,

 I support your enthusiasm, but what experience in rust elimination do you have that would qualify you to deal successfully with this difficult project?

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Robert will supply the beer

Robert will supply the beer that will enable me to forget how bad the rust really is.:)

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Location, location.

Alright then.  I suppose that encouragement from a distance is better than no help at all.

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Let us know when the project

Let us know when the project begins, I'm sure that a sizeable portion of The Star can be set aside for the ongoing project.

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The car is in South Phoenix

The car is in South Phoenix being restored by a Mexican body shop.. They tried to take the body off the other day but forgot to take out all the firewall bolts and bent the body in half.  The body is not really savable anyway because it is so rusty you cannot really weld to it. The owner is so cheap he wont hire anyone qualified to work on this poor car.

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Mexican body shop? Hmmm....I

Mexican body shop? Hmmm....I didn't think cars rusted in Mexico. Good luck to the owner.

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I have not noticed rust on my

I have not noticed rust on my parets cars. Except the the lug nuts to hold the wheels. I am sure there is rust under the car in some form from normal wear and tear. We keep the cars clean all the time. I generaly go to the car wash every week or every two weeks and the cars go in for servicing at a Mercedes dealership all the time.

When my dad had his W201 and W202 we had no problem or problems with either of them. I have heard that the W203's have had rust problems. I dont recall seeing rust on our 2001 W203 or 2066 W203. But with that being said and I guess this part should be in the W203 forum but we did have a lot of problems with the 2001 W203 such as constantly changing bulbs, a faulty alternater, air tempreture sensor was faulty a few drained batteries and severial other problems. The only major problem we had with the MY 2006 W203 was the automatic door lock would not lock the car even though it was set for that. The two minor problems we had with the the 2006 car was a faulty sensor for the oil and a burnt out moter for the passenger side whiper arm.

So far our 2009 W204 has been our best bet. The problems we had were minor. A few burnt out bulbs here and there but that is exsptected, loose whireing for the satilite raido, a cracked lens mirror house as well as a defective seal, passenger "A" piller was loose, a faulty sensor for the washer fluid tank, problem with the engine temp guage and had to get the motor mountcs replaced. one recall. a faulty horn and damaged struts and sway bars. But I dont think the damged struts and sway bars were a defect I think it was because my dad went over a few pot holes. Oh yeah and replaced severial tires and one rim. A few other problems were from the dealer but were corrected right away.

So if anyone is looking for a new or a used (CPO) Mercedes my best bet would be to get the W204.

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rust

I've found a marine product,great source,called salt off made by starbright in fla.,which you can find in many marine catalogues,i get a Defender cat. from Conn. the product is cheap and works to break down salt so it can be rinsed away with a hose it can come with a hose spray applicator .spray on salt rinses away and it leaves a polymer film protective coat which helps protect from more salt on the metal for a short ,days? while.the stuff really does make a salt coating just rinse away and leaves no noticeable residue . Plain water will not remove a salt coating.when the wet dries the white stuff is back.Saltoff works,its easy as using the hose in winter,in the adirondacks.i dont use my 96 sl in winter but thats just me.i do use saltoff on my 90 acura legend and it seems to help quite a bit.

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Thanks for the tip Jeffrey. I

Thanks for the tip Jeffrey. I will look for that product.

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stricht8 wrote:Thanks for the

stricht8 wrote:
Thanks for the tip Jeffrey. I will look for that product.
Are we ready to get started then?

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The CLK Man wrote:stricht8

The CLK Man wrote:
stricht8 wrote:
Thanks for the tip Jeffrey. I will look for that product.
Are we ready to get started then?

Sure.  Do you have a rusty gullwing?

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Wait a minute there

Wait a minute there cowboy....aren't trombones brass?

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Rust !!!! The worst of four

Rust !!!! The worst of four letter words. Hey, that Gullwing could be fixed. All of the body parts are available. So is the chassis.

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Tom Hanson wrote: Rust

Tom Hanson wrote:

Rust !!!! The worst of four letter words. Hey, that Gullwing could be fixed. All of the body parts are available. So is the chassis.

Well that's good to know. So is the chassis considered the space frame?

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Space frame is the modern

Space frame is the modern name for it. Used to call it tube frame. Then again, nomenclature can also change from one State to another.... 

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So how much does the frame

So how much does the frame cost?

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Rust on 2003 C240 wagon

Now I know I'm not alone...my wagon is rusting badly all over, and if I don't fix it soon it will look like that rusted Gullwing( slight exaggeration).  I see many older MBs on the road without a bit of rust, and when I brought the car to a couple of local body shops they thought that MB had done a poor job of priming their vehicles  in the 2003 era.  So- I took the car to MB, and explained that I could understand that a car could wear out from use, but I hadn't expected my MB to self-destruct.  They agreed that I had a legitimate complaint, and offered to do the body work and split the cost with me.  I am trying to decide if it is worth putting any money into the car, as I am afraid that it might continue to sprout new rust elsewhere.  Anybody got any thoughts on this matter?    Paul Duboff

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Paul Duboff wrote: Now I know

Paul Duboff wrote:

Now I know I'm not alone...my wagon is rusting badly all over, and if I don't fix it soon it will look like that rusted Gullwing( slight exaggeration).  I see many older MBs on the road without a bit of rust, and when I brought the car to a couple of local body shops they thought that MB had done a poor job of priming their vehicles  in the 2003 era.  So- I took the car to MB, and explained that I could understand that a car could wear out from use, but I hadn't expected my MB to self-destruct.  They agreed that I had a legitimate complaint, and offered to do the body work and split the cost with me.  I am trying to decide if it is worth putting any money into the car, as I am afraid that it might continue to sprout new rust elsewhere.  Anybody got any thoughts on this matter?    Paul Duboff

After a major rust elimination elimination project on my 30-year old wagon, which restoration cost plenty money and trouble, I'm against rust restoration UNLESS one is willing to spend bigger bucks and do it from the frame up because one is a collector, which I'm not, and insists on keeping this particular car indefinitely, which I don't.  

It is my contention that once a car starts to rust it will continue to rust indefinitely.  Rust elimination efforts provide a pause, during which time the car looks fine for a while. But eventually the rust will return, if it ever really went away.  Whether rust is a design or manufacturing defect, or is caused by water or salt, is irrelevant.  Once it's here and visible from 10 feet, the car ought to go, unless you can do the rust elimination yourself, so you know it's done right, or you are able to pay others to do it the same way or better.

If any of my cars ever rusts again to a major extent, I will replace them rather than go to the trouble of eliminating the rust.  That is, unless I have the really big money and time to throw at it, because I MUST keep that car. Ask yourself who must keep a car that exhibits the equivalent of a degenerative disease? A car-crazy person like me who likes and feels comfortable in a particular car and wants to keep it longer, may have a go at it once.  But never again because based on recent experience it's not worth it.

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I agree with Alex. Unless

I agree with Alex. Unless your car is very collectible, has significant sentimental value or you can and enjoy doing it yourself the right way then don't bother. Sell it and buy a rust free example. You will be better off in the long run. Mercedes screwed up and let down it's customers during the mid nineties to mid 2000s. Hopefully they will never do it again. If I start seeing premature rust on a W204, 212 or 221 chassis car then I will never buy a new mercedes again. I'll stick with the pre 1993 models or just buy a BMW!

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stricht8 wrote:So how much

stricht8 wrote:
So how much does the frame cost?


I build a replica frame but it does not come with any sort of serial numbers.  It is exact in every respect and even uses the original 4130 German steel... $115,000K


The truth be known; I could restore the rusty Gullwing too; but the owner is so cheap he refuses to spend the required amount to do it correctly.  I dont want to skimp on my standards. Can you imagine the press I would get after selling the gullwing at RM auctions last year for a world record $1.375 M then doing a half a$$ job on 5500192 ?  

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I don't blame you one bit.

I don't blame you one bit. Your reputation is at stake. Your standards are your standards. There is no reason to lower them for anybody!

Hale Merced wrote:

stricht8 wrote:
So how much does the frame cost?


I build a replica frame but it does not come with any sort of serial numbers.  It is exact in every respect and even uses the original 4130 German steel... $115,000K


The truth be known; I could restore the rusty Gullwing too; but the owner is so cheap he refuses to spend the required amount to do it correctly.  I dont want to skimp on my standards. Can you imagine the press I would get after selling the gullwing at RM auctions last year for a world record $1.375 M then doing a half a$$ job on 5500192 ?  

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Rust Chat

I just wandered on this site and could not help but notice the excessive chat between Stricht8 & CLK Man talking back and forth about beer mostly and nothing that would interest other folks.  You two guys submitted nearly 20 messages aimed at the two of you.  Why don't you  send private messages  with your "small" talk and leave the forum to a format that's at least  half way interesting to other members.  Larry

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larryled wrote:I just

larryled wrote:
I just wandered on this site and could not help but notice the excessive chat between Stricht8 & CLK Man talking back and forth about beer mostly and nothing that would interest other folks.  You two guys submitted nearly 20 messages aimed at the two of you.  Why don't you  send private messages  with your "small" talk and leave the forum to a format that's at least  half way interesting to other members.  Larry

If you look at my profile you will see that I have been an MBCA member for almost 16 years and I have contributed over 1000 posts to this forum the vast majority of which have been more than relevant to MB cars. We are all MB enthusiasts here but we have other interests as well as we are human. Oh and don't forget that I started this thread so if you don't like what I have to say then you are welcome to not read it and start your own!

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larryled wrote:I just

larryled wrote:
I just wandered on this site and could not help but notice the excessive chat between Stricht8 & CLK Man talking back and forth about beer mostly and nothing that would interest other folks.  You two guys submitted nearly 20 messages aimed at the two of you.  Why don't you  send private messages  with your "small" talk and leave the forum to a format that's at least  half way interesting to other members.  Larry

Oh, and MY thread is about Mercedes rust. I don't see one reference in this post of yours that pertains to the topic at hand. If you which to chastise me for a couple of interspersed OT posts in MY thread then you could send me a private message instead. That way MY thread won't be diluted with your irrelevant banter.

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stricht8 wrote:larryled

stricht8 wrote:
larryled wrote:
I just wandered on this site and could not help but notice the excessive chat between Stricht8 & CLK Man talking back and forth about beer mostly and nothing that would interest other folks.  You two guys submitted nearly 20 messages aimed at the two of you.  Why don't you  send private messages  with your "small" talk and leave the forum to a format that's at least  half way interesting to other members.  Larry
If you look at my profile you will see that I have been an MBCA member for almost 16 years and I have contributed over 1000 posts to this forum the vast majority of which have been more than relevant to MB cars. We are all MB enthusiasts here but we have other interests as well as we are human. Oh and don't forget that I started this thread so if you don't like what I have to say then you are welcome to not read it and start your own!
  Can I get an Amennnaaa.

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stricht8 wrote:larryled

stricht8 wrote:
larryled wrote:
I just wandered on this site and could not help but notice the excessive chat between Stricht8 & CLK Man talking back and forth about beer mostly and nothing that would interest other folks.  You two guys submitted nearly 20 messages aimed at the two of you.  Why don't you  send private messages  with your "small" talk and leave the forum to a format that's at least  half way interesting to other members.  Larry
Oh, and MY thread is about Mercedes rust. I don't see one reference in this post of yours that pertains to the topic at hand. If you which to chastise me for a couple of interspersed OT posts in MY thread then you could send me a private message instead. That way MY thread won't be diluted with your irrelevant banter.
Preach on my Brother.

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MTI, my point is that I have

MTI, my point is that I have contributed many, many posts to this forum the vast majority of which have MB content. If I choose to interrupt my own thread and then resume that is my perogative. And yes, seniority does play some role here. How would you feel if you were reprimanded by someone who has made one or two posts on this forum? Larryled has made about forty posts and then he comes here and hijacks my thread to chastise me?

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I find it amusing that I can

I find it amusing that I can never get anything but contradiction from you. I also find it amusing that you are also hijacking this thread. And by the way, larryleds points were not valid. If you follow the thread you can see that my "OT" posts for the most part flow with the topic at hand. My comments to clkman about restoring a rusty gullwing, while in jest, still pertain to the topic of rust. There is absolutely no reason why we must be so rigid here. This is not boot camp and as long as I'm here I'll see to it that it stays that way for the greater good of this club and this forum.

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I'm perfectly tolerant here.

I'm perfectly tolerant here. Who rejected Clkman from the get go due to his unorthodox style? Wasn't me. Larryled was critical of my posts which as I already stated flowed well with the thread. I didn't hijack anything. The hijacking was initiated by him and is now being propagated by us!
Honestly, I really don't want to argue with you any further. We both share a lot of enthusiasm for this forum and for these cars but obviously express it differently. When I criticize Mercedes I do it because I really care for the mark and want to see it do well. That is why I started this thread after all. I'm hoping that some higher ups in the company will read it and view it as constructive criticism.

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Here's a suggestion, offered

Here's a suggestion, offered constructively.  You, CLKman and others should do what you feel is best, whether seriously or in jest; however if other's voice their opinions that the conversations may be silly, juvenile or some other aspect, then let them.  No one should be prevented from posting their open and honest opinion(s), right?

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Please lead us back to RUST

Stricht8,

 The subject of this thread is RUST.  When a person starts a thread with a subject, it is reasonable to assume that subsequent posts are about the subject.  If often happens that the thread gets away from the subject but returns eventually.  When it veers off too much, chances are that the thread loses interest from those who invested in it and it fades away.

 If the thread veers off and someone objects because he'd like to get back to the subject, that objection seems reasonable and ought to be respected.  If not respected, then moderation is in order.

 I've said previously in different words that off-topic banter runs the risk of causing arguments among forum participants because it consists of more opinion and commentary than statements of experience or knowledge that are easier to express respectfully. 

 So consider this as moderation:  If you feel possessive about this thread, then please stop bickering and lead us back to the subject.

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On the W01 and W124, those

On the W01 and W124, those enclosed jack hole covers were notorious for corrosion, likely since the plugs kept moisture trapped in the steel tubes that the jack was inserted into.  The rust would really destroy the lower sills.  However I haven't seen a similar weakness in the W202 sills or the subsequent E-Class

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MTI wrote:Here's a

MTI wrote:
Here's a suggestion, offered constructively.  You, CLKman and others should do what you feel is best, whether seriously or in jest; however if other's voice their opinions that the conversations may be silly, juvenile or some other aspect, then let them.  No one should be prevented from posting their open and honest opinion(s), right?

Agreed.

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Alex

Alex wrote:

Stricht8,

 The subject of this thread is RUST.  When a person starts a thread with a subject, it is reasonable to assume that subsequent posts are about the subject.  If often happens that the thread gets away from the subject but returns eventually.  When it veers off too much, chances are that the thread loses interest from those who invested in it and it fades away.

 If the thread veers off and someone objects because he'd like to get back to the subject, that objection seems reasonable and ought to be respected.  If not respected, then moderation is in order.

 I've said previously in different words that off-topic banter runs the risk of causing arguments among forum participants because it consists of more opinion and commentary than statements of experience or knowledge that are easier to express respectfully. 

 So consider this as moderation:  If you feel possessive about this thread, then please stop bickering and lead us back to the subject.

That is your opinion, strict8 started this thread and if he wants to talk about other things that is his right as the thread starter. You hijacked my Harry Morgan thread yesterday and just because you are a moderator, that doesn't give you the right to tell people how their threads should proceed.

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MTI wrote:On the W01 and

MTI wrote:
On the W01 and W124, those enclosed jack hole covers were notorious for corrosion, likely since the plugs kept moisture trapped in the steel tubes that the jack was inserted into.  The rust would really destroy the lower sills.  However I haven't seen a similar weakness in the W202 sills or the subsequent E-Class

Back on track finally!
Yes they seem to have fixed that. The 202, 203, 210 and 220 seem to suffer from a different kind of rust which I consider more terminal. The rust on these cars just appears everywhere almost at random. Something went really wrong in the corrosion protection dept. The 201 and 124 rust is more localized and therefore more manageable. It also takes longer for those cars to exhibit signs of rust.

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Many threads get "hijacked,"

Many threads get "hijacked," and I can live w/ that as long as we remain civil. Once threads reach 25-30 posts this is quite common on all forums. So 1. let's not get our noses out of joint over a little OT, and 2. let's remain civil. Thx guys...

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Jayhawk wrote:Many threads

Jayhawk wrote:
Many threads get "hijacked," and I can live w/ that as long as we remain civil. Once threads reach 25-30 posts this is quite common on all forums. So 1. let's not get our noses out of joint over a little OT, and 2. let's remain civil. Thx guys...

Gene, I agree with you that threads can go off track in the course, whether the original poster does it is irrelevant, I have always attempted to remain civil and will continue to do so, as my posts illustrate; however I would suggest that a caution be given to others that use the "flag as offensive" button indiscriminately.  Thanks.

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MTI wrote:Jayhawk wrote:Many

MTI wrote:
Jayhawk wrote:
Many threads get "hijacked," and I can live w/ that as long as we remain civil. Once threads reach 25-30 posts this is quite common on all forums. So 1. let's not get our noses out of joint over a little OT, and 2. let's remain civil. Thx guys...

Gene, I agree with you that threads can go off track in the course, whether the original poster does it is irrelevant, I have always attempted to remain civil and will continue to do so, as my posts illustrate; however I would suggest that a caution be given to others that use the "flag as offensive" button indiscriminately.  Thanks.


I agree Mark. I get quite a few PMs but don't see nearly as many "flagged" posts, and urge everyone to contact me before they "flag" a post because 1. it makes them temporarily disappear, and 2. it makes a lot of work for me.  

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When my clk 320 was hit, my

When my clk 320 was hit, my buddy at the body shop had to remove some the plastic trim to repair the dents. He was surprised at the amount of rust underneath the plastic.

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Jayhawk wrote:Many threads

Jayhawk wrote:
Many threads get "hijacked," and I can live w/ that as long as we remain civil. Once threads reach 25-30 posts this is quite common on all forums. So 1. let's not get our noses out of joint over a little OT, and 2. let's remain civil. Thx guys...
Hey Gene, what's for Lunch. the humble pie I ate yesterday didn't taste good to me.

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The CLK Man wrote: When my

The CLK Man wrote:

When my clk 320 was hit, my buddy at the body shop had to remove some the plastic trim to repair the dents. He was surprised at the amount of rust underneath the plastic.

I'm not surprised! The Mercedes cars of that era should be forgotten in my opinion although I can't say that I ever saw a rusty CLK.

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stricht8 wrote:The CLK Man

stricht8 wrote:
The CLK Man wrote:

When my clk 320 was hit, my buddy at the body shop had to remove some the plastic trim to repair the dents. He was surprised at the amount of rust underneath the plastic.
I'm not surprised! The Mercedes cars of that era should be forgotten in my opinion although I can't say that I ever saw a rusty CLK.
Here is a pic of the rust on my clk 320.

clk rust.jpg
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http://www.benzworld.org/foru

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w203-c-class/1595780-major-rust-damage-tailgate-2003-wagon.html

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